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Topic: First Timer Attempting Mega Man Rom Hack (Read 2 times)
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StarsimsUniverse
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« on: September 07, 2008, 02:38:40 pm » |
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Greetings romhacking forum-goers. The name's StarsimsUniverse. I've been a follower of the ROM scene for quite a few years, never gone as far as to participate in forum discussions before, but frankly, I've never had anything to say or contribute to the community. Some of you may find my username familiar, I'm one of the contributors to the fangame "Mushroom Kingdom Fusion" by Judgespear. I'm mainly the level designer for the Mega Man levels in that game. I have a vague idea how to create levels using Game Maker 7.0. We use the Hello 3 Engine. Recently, because we're using 16 Bit graphics for the game, (Super Mario Allstars. Super Mario World, Wily Wars, etc) I have a vast collection of sprites for Mega Man. Some ripped from Wily Wars, and even some that have been custom created using Wily Wars style of pallete and shading. It occurred to me with this much material, I pondered if it was possible if we could experiment and try a Mega Man 1 ROM Hack, replacing the 8 Bit sprites and tilesets with the Wily Wars style pallete and graphics. I have no ROM coding experience, I could merely provide the sprites and tilesets (hopefully 16x16 tiles will work) and this should be a simple ROM to create, just almost cutting and pasting the existing layouts so it has Wily Wars quality to it. Here's an example of some of my Mega Man sprites and edits from "Mushroom Kingdom Fusion". Some of the Wily Wars sprites were a tad weird compared to the original NES sprites so I've done a few recolours myself. Alot of these can be imported and used for my ROM Hack idea. Is anyone willing to attempt to try this ROM hack out with me?
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« Last Edit: September 07, 2008, 05:23:22 pm by I.S.T. »
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Ryusui
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« Reply #1 on: September 07, 2008, 04:32:20 pm » |
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First off: this doesn't belong here. This belongs under General Romhacking, or maaaaaybe Personal Projects.
Second off: that's actually some pretty nice work you've done there.
Third off: what you're asking is impossible. Ever wonder why Megaman 1-3 didn't look like The Wily Wars the first time? Sprites and tiles on the NES are limited to four, count 'em, four colors. They can use different palettes of four colors, but no individual sprite or tile can use more than four colors period, counting transparency. (If you're curious, sprites and backgrounds that do use more than four colors - like Megaman himself - are comprised of multiple sprites and tiles. But that works only as far as, say, giving Megaman a flesh-tone face and white eyes, not giving him shading.)
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I.S.T.
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« Reply #2 on: September 07, 2008, 05:23:47 pm » |
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I moved your topic, and changed the two largest images into links.
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DarthNemesis
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« Reply #3 on: September 07, 2008, 05:25:53 pm » |
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You couldn't hack the new images into MM1, but you could probably recreate the MM1 stages in MM7.
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dshadoff
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« Reply #4 on: September 07, 2008, 07:50:24 pm » |
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Interesting... see this thread: http://www.romhacking.net/forum/index.php/topic,6894.0.htmltomaitheous has hacked the original Megaman to run on the PC Engine/Turbografx system, which is capable of the enhanced palette (mentioned somewhere in that thread). He might very well be interested in doing something on this...
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StarsimsUniverse
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« Reply #5 on: September 07, 2008, 08:26:40 pm » |
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Aww darn. I guess I didn't notce that hacks like "Rock Man No Constancy", "Rock Man Minimum" and "Dues Ex Machina" may have elaborate new tilesets, but you're saying even those have limited 4 colours?? Gosh darn it, there goes my idea. But... after joining this forum I did notice tomaitheous' similar project. I'm open to merging my ideas with his. Though hacking mm7 sounds possible but alot more work needed. Seeing as we'd be recreating the Super Nintendo equivialnt of the Sega Genesis 16 Bit Mega Man game of Wily Wars. But I'm not too enthusiastic with attempting something as complicated as editing a mm7 game so massively into a mm1 game. I fear I may scrap my idea. (PS. Incase you're wondering about the HUD display in my screenshots saying "Mario". Thats a skin modded version of Mario. Our fangame has external player sprites so people can replace the playable characters with their own character sprites. Being the Mega Man designer for the game I made SNES pallete Mega Man sprites for fans to try out. For plot reasons Mega Man isn't playable in the game, he's only an npc. But Roll takes his place.)
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« Last Edit: September 07, 2008, 08:42:52 pm by StarsimsUniverse »
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tomaitheous
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« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2008, 10:35:14 pm » |
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You did see the thread dshadoff linked to??
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tc
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« Reply #7 on: September 08, 2008, 01:02:43 am » |
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I've never considered what 4-6 would look like, given a Wily Wars style makeover. Keep it up! :thumbsup:
Being on PC gives you a lot more flexibility. I think you'll find it easier to work with than those older systems, not as many annoying limitations.
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StarsimsUniverse
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« Reply #8 on: September 08, 2008, 09:44:11 am » |
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I've never considered what 4-6 would look like, given a Wily Wars style makeover. Keep it up! :thumbsup:
Being on PC gives you a lot more flexibility. I think you'll find it easier to work with than those older systems, not as many annoying limitations.
Well then I'll continue with Mushroom Kingdom Fusion. Your right a PC exe is much easier and more flexible. Our Mega Man levels have turned out to be really well designed and beautiful, plus the cool experience of seeing many Mega Man 4+ levels pimped up to 16 Bit quality. While we've been making our own edited tilesets I found others had beaten us to it. I'm going to speak to this guy and ask kindly for permission to use his tilesets... http://forums.stencyl.com/showthread.php?tid=2681&page=1 Currently we have Skull man and Pharoah Man as two of the MM4 levels in the Rock Man Realm. I guess I could still keep you guys up to date on my progress on Mushroom Kingdom Fusion, then? Even if I'm scrapping my ROM idea? Does this Message Board allow discussion on fangames as well as hacked ROMs? Check out the kind of 16 Bit rejigging we've been able to make in our game.. here's a mock up of a planned Tornado Man stage (with an 8-Bit mock up for comparison) its pretty good looking, but we may still change the windows.
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Disch
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« Reply #9 on: September 08, 2008, 10:47:39 am » |
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pimped up to 16 Bit quality.
Bit depth in terms of graphic quality measures the number of bits per pixel. In this case, you're talking about SNES/Genesis graphics which are 4bpp (4 bits per pixel -- IE: 4-bit, 16 colors). Real 16-bit graphics can have 65536 colors per pixel, not just 16. Your graphics look like they could be 8-bit (256 colors), but if it's a PC game, it's more than likely 32 or 24 bit (not just 16 bit) </hypertechnicality> </minor pet peeve> I don't know why... it just bugs me when people refer to SNES graphics as "16-bit" and NES graphics as "8-bit". I know I'm being overly critical and nobody cares about that but me... but I couldn't resist posting. Don't mind me.
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Dragonsbrethren
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« Reply #10 on: September 08, 2008, 03:37:29 pm » |
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Heh, I'm the same way Disch, I blame you for it though. Way back I made the same mistake, you corrected me, and it's become one of my pet peeves since then too. (I don't know why I remember this, especially when I tend to forget far more important things regularly...) I know the spriters tend to use the defense that they're referring to a style (The style of the graphics that appeared on a 16 bit console, not actual 16 bit graphics) but that's invalidated by the fact that the Genesis game had vastly different graphics compared to the SNES game. It would be far more sense to refer to them as NES-style, SNES-style, Genesis-style, etc. </even more off topic> I haven't replied to this yet, StarsimsUniverse , your sprite work and foreground graphics are great, along with most of your backgrounds. I'm not too keen on the photo realistic backgrounds in some of your shots though, they seem really out of place with the colorful foregrounds. One thing I'd suggest correcting is the proportions of a few enemies, when they did the Wily Wars graphics they scaled Mega Man up slightly but didn't scale up any of the enemies, so the Sniper Joes which were supposed to be as tall as Mega Man are too tiny in that version. Unfortunately this also happened to poor Proto Man, so he looked like a midget compared to his brother...
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Nightcrawler
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« Reply #11 on: September 08, 2008, 06:38:36 pm » |
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I know the spriters tend to use the defense that they're referring to a style (The style of the graphics that appeared on a 16 bit console, not actual 16 bit graphics) but that's invalidated by the fact that the Genesis game had vastly different graphics compared to the SNES game. It would be far more sense to refer to them as NES-style, SNES-style, Genesis-style, etc.
Genesis and SNES has 'vastly' different graphics? That's news to me. Minor resolution differences, some extra colors on the SNES, but other than that, I think they are very similar looks wise with the graphics of many games. Even if I agreed they were different, I'd definitely not say vastly.. It's not like Playstation vs. NES.. That's what I'd call vastly different!
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Dragonsbrethren
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« Reply #12 on: September 08, 2008, 06:42:24 pm » |
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Genesis and SNES has 'vastly' different graphics? That's news to me. Minor resolution differences, some extra colors on the SNES, but other than that, I think they are very similar looks wise with the graphics of many games. Even if I agreed they were different, I'd definitely not say vastly.. It's not like Playstation vs. NES.. That's what I'd call vastly different! You misunderstood what I was talking about, I was referring to the Mega Man games exclusively in this case. The Genesis game used an entirely different style that was more akin to the NES games than the SNES game did, which used large cartoony sprites and backgrounds. In this case you can't use "16-bit" as a style, as there were two completely different styles that appeared on 16 bit consoles, and a third if you count the X series games.
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tc
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« Reply #13 on: September 08, 2008, 09:38:50 pm » |
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If I recall...
SNES had a wider color palette, more modern sound chip, larger max cart size, and better transparency/scaling/rotation/etc. Yet wasn't as fast at large amounts of moving objects. So SNES tended to get "eye candy" like RPGs, and Genesis got more action games.
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StarsimsUniverse
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« Reply #14 on: September 09, 2008, 09:23:48 am » |
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One thing I'd suggest correcting is the proportions of a few enemies, when they did the Wily Wars graphics they scaled Mega Man up slightly but didn't scale up any of the enemies, so the Sniper Joes which were supposed to be as tall as Mega Man are too tiny in that version. Unfortunately this also happened to poor Proto Man, so he looked like a midget compared to his brother...
Its ok, we're keeping the original size of the enemies because most of the playable are similar in size to the original NES Mega Man. If you stand the new playable Roll next to our line of Sniper Joes, she's the same size as them. She looks taller in our image earlier in the thread because she's leaping. Anyway I may ask this thread to be closed so I can post a new one thats more relevantly placed in a fangame project section, this is in General Rom Hacking. If the subject with my ROM Hack is over I'll create a new subject. I wanna keep you guys up to date on Mushroom Kingdom Fusion, you guys seem to like it!
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