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Topic: ROM Hacking Documents: What's Missing? (Read 2 times)
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Spikeman
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« Reply #15 on: February 25, 2007, 05:57:16 am » |
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Yeah just make it a simple HTML page. My opinion on documents is that they should all be simple HTML filled with image. And preferably not a lot of formatting, just things like headings and other organizational things.
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Suzaku
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« Reply #16 on: February 25, 2007, 06:01:15 am » |
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In cases with lots of text and pictures when formatting is important I've always preferred PDFs. Though, those can be a little more time-consuming to make. And then there's the size thing.
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Cyberman
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« Reply #17 on: February 26, 2007, 12:45:26 am » |
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All right what is the prefered format? I have the original Intel 8086 and 8087 Data sheets (scanned) I think I would like to convert it to RTF or PDF format. Since the documents are scanned (mutter) I will have to do some work to clean them up and shrink them to a NORMAL PDF or RTF file size.
Also I found Ralph Browns Interrupt list immensely useful as well.
Can anyone think of other Old PC information needed? Audio ADLib? Sound Bast...err Blaster Video VGA/EGA/CGA/MDA/Herc/PCJr Are just a few I can think of.
Cyb
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Griff Morivan
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« Reply #18 on: February 26, 2007, 12:20:57 pm » |
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What I meant before when I was being dragged off line was that there should probably be a collective document on Final Fantasy of things that TONS of first-time hackers ask. The locations for the opening, the bridge, the end, how to make the character names 5 slots wide, how to edit this or that. Something less complete as FFBytes, but something that the first-time hacker can use without going "Duh-hur wha?"
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Kitsune Sniper
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« Reply #19 on: March 04, 2007, 02:34:24 am » |
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Ka bump.
So I've been poking around with making a title screen hacking document. The stuff I do to optimize graphics and tilesets. I'm not sure if this is a good idea because of the "I'm too visual" thing - I can't explain things with words, I have to demonstrate it to get people to understand me. I'm also used to uh, using several tools that lots of people consider outdated - Tile Layer Pro and Translhextion, for one; not to mention Paint Shop Pro 7... I do use Adobe Photoshop but it's not as good for the things I do.
Thoughts?
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« Last Edit: March 04, 2007, 03:18:52 am by Kitsune Sniper »
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Numonohi_Boi
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« Reply #20 on: March 04, 2007, 02:45:28 am » |
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Paint Shop Pro is EXCELLENT, you can't go wrong with guys from IL&M, you might want to update your version if possible, you can get a free trial of Paint Shop Pro XI but I guess that doesn't help you in the long run.
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Kitsune Sniper
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« Reply #21 on: March 04, 2007, 03:19:10 am » |
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Paint Shop Pro is EXCELLENT, you can't go wrong with guys from IL&M, you might want to update your version if possible, you can get a free trial of Paint Shop Pro XI but I guess that doesn't help you in the long run.
I have Paint Shop Pro 7, not 5. Oops. :p
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deespence2929
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« Reply #22 on: March 05, 2007, 01:17:22 am » |
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Last time I looked, what this site needed was a doc covering how you swap pallettes used. Not change the pallette set, but what pallette is assigned to what sprites. I remember there was one, and the method worked good for Dragon Warrior, but not for any other games I tried it on.
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StIoachim
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« Reply #23 on: March 08, 2007, 09:59:02 pm » |
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I haven't used it for romhacking, but regarding API calls, you can profile with Dependency Walker, an (I think official developement) Microsoft utility, that can be great to find some specifict calls that you want to modify
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Neil
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« Reply #24 on: March 26, 2008, 05:15:05 pm » |
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Okay. I'm going to violate a forum rule (maybe since I'm a moderator I'll issue myself a warning) and revive this year old thread.
A post by Rai in the screenshots thread got me thinking that maybe what we need is some getting started tips. People have gotten themselves into the idea that you can't do an decent translation without learning assembly or something. There's a lot of little tricks that haven't been really written down that would be great for getting people started.
So it's got me thinking. What is the absolute minimum you need to understand to do a decent translation hack. So you've got tables, pointers, graphics (fonts). The three pillars. And once you've got them down pat, there's some tips and tricks you can do to make things better. Font tricks like dual tile (erroneously disparaged with terms like "squishy tile"), simple small asm hacks (for example window resizing or in some cases font resizing).
The very idea of collecting together tips and tricks about "simple" things that can make a hack look a bit better may be very beneficial. Beyond the advantage of getting better looking results, it may also help people think about the engine behind the data differently, perhaps getting people to be better hackers.
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Karatorian
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« Reply #25 on: March 26, 2008, 07:20:16 pm » |
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One doc I think is somewhat needed is a complete DOC on the SMB level format. The current one is woefully incomplete and has parts where it simply says the author doesn't know how things really work. For my work on the NES side of the SMBS project, I had to read the ASM to figure out several things. Of course, that's an option (perhaps even the best one) for an experianced hacker, but as a lot of newbies start on SMB as their first hack, a better doc would be good for them. On the other tentacle, there are several SMB level editors, so perhaps the lack isn't quite as great as it seems to me.
A complete translation hacking tutorial that explains how to translate a game for a newbie would be a really good resource, epecially given the translation heavy focus of this site. On a related note, documents that encourage newbies to produce something other than simple graphics alterations would be good. Of course, learning to modify graphics is a needed skill for many sorts of hacks, but, honestly too many hacks (thankfully not hosted here) do nothing more than that. Docs that explain the many other things one can do with a ROM hack, while catering to the inexperianced would be a good addition.
It also seems that pointers still need more attention, even though several docs on the subject exist.
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Nightcrawler
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« Reply #26 on: March 27, 2008, 08:48:33 am » |
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Neil, if you could write a document explaining how to locate the pointers, relocate, expand, and successfully insert the text back into that Fire Emblem game Rai was working on without using a debugger or knowing any assembly, I'd be seriously impressed. Not only would I be impressed, but it would probably be an invaluable resource. I'm serious. I can't say I could come up with a way myself. People have gotten themselves into the idea that you can't do an decent translation without learning assembly or something. I believe there are certainly games that you cannot do a translation AT ALL for without assembly. Games with compressed data come to mind. Though compression aside, I've seen several things that you probably wouldn't be able to do without assembly that were required just to do the translation and not really related to quality. It depends on what the game is doing and how it's structured. I think people get themselves into the assembly idea because: 1. Assembly/Reverse engineering works 100% of the time if you're skilled enough. 2. Non assembly techniques work a fraction of the time and aren't useful beyond some games. So... there's really no negatives to going in the assembly direction other than complexity. The non assembly methods aren't going to work in all instances. It also needs to be made perfectly clear that every game can be totally different and your non assembly techniques will likely fail on many other games. At least if you're aware of that, you'll know to try something different rather than think the method is supposed to work and ask why it doesn't. Hell, even a full tutorial on hacking Game X from start to finish may not be all that useful. It may even generate even more forum requests because people saw method X was used in that tutorial, but it doesn't work in their game. You know my views. Conceptual documents are key. People get way too focused on specifics that don't work beyond a narrow range and don't understand why. They dismiss documents for platform X thinking they'll be no help. etc. etc. I've been there and explained that before.
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Neil
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« Reply #27 on: March 27, 2008, 09:20:03 am » |
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Without the debugger pointers might be a bit difficult to generalize. You don't need to know assembly to use a debugger successfully. It sure helps, but if you have a document that shows you the difference between a value and an address, you should be able to get alone with some simple tracing ala your fire emblem example.
Games with compression really depend. Lets say you've got a game with some form of LZ compression. Assuming you can find the script, say by chance, or through luck with the debugger, or sheer ballzy "i should buy a lottery ticket" corruption, you stand a decent chance of being able to work with the game. If its an SNES game, you can expand the rom, and assuming you can program with some language, be it php, c++, or hell, even basic you can use existing code that's already available from several different sources on this site. If you couldn't figure out how to recompress the data, by setting the buffer to 0 you achieve basically the same thing. Heck, if you understand the extreme basics of assembly, you too can figure out how to skip right over a compression subroutine. that would admittedly be a slightly more optimistic idea of what a newbie can accomplish. most of what I've said though, if generalized and explained clearly enough, is well within the grasp of someone who understands tables, can use a hex editor, and can use a graphics editor.
There are a lot of shortcuts that, while yes it would be awesome to just bite the bullet and learn assembly, can get you through your first project with fairly decent results.
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weissvulf
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« Reply #28 on: March 27, 2008, 02:04:27 pm » |
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I'd like to see a document giving the breakdown of common PS2 2D formats (like Tim2) and also info on adding subtitles to common PS1(STR) or PS2 (PSS)video files. I wasn't able to find significant info on either of these topics anywhere.
To offer my novice opinion about Neil and Nightcrawler discussion: I think you both have a valid point but I definitely think Neil’s idea has merit. If it included a decent section on how to choose an apropriate game to begin with, a 'non-assembly' beginner’s guide might avoid nightcrawler's mentioned pitfall. It seems like a lot of beginners try to take on a world renowned RPG installment that no one else has managed to crack in the past 20 years. If instead they were given a few pointers on how to choose a simple appropriate game they might actually succeed instead of flooding forums with unanswerable questions.
For instance, it seems to me that the PS1 is an excellent platform for a beginner to start on. Because of the room available on a CD, developers tended to be very sloppy with space and many tittles don't use compression. Most of the time things are even divided into nice little packages like 'Dialogue.bin' or 'Movies/Opening.str' - a beginner's dream! Formats were semi standardized (TIM, STR SEQ) which makes them easy to recognize and alter. There are probably even some simple titles like fighters that could be completely translated just using a photo editor on Tim files.
Another thing to point out in a 'non-assembly' beginner's guide is that you don't have to completely translate a game to have your project be of value. I've seen some titles where just a few key menu parts were translated and it made the game infinitely more enjoyable to play.
-just my 2 cents :huh:
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FinalMinuet
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« Reply #29 on: March 27, 2008, 04:17:47 pm » |
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We need hack and translation postmortems.
You know the saying about learning more from your mistakes than from your successes? I think it could apply here as well. I've found in programming that journaling my progress helps tremendously. So why not journal a ROM hack? Think of all the obscure, crazy techniques you've come up with on the spot that have been lost to time. Think of all the moments of clarity where everything made perfect sense for no reason whatsoever. Sharing those could be as invaluable to the community as technical documentation. After all, hacking is part creativity.
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