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Topic: DQ5 update (Read 3244 times)
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DaMarsMan
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« Reply #15 on: February 14, 2007, 02:19:06 pm » |
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Ok...Guessin he aint around anymore.
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byuu
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« Reply #16 on: February 14, 2007, 02:44:57 pm » |
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She, for the translator. Of course, you'd also need Geechyguy's approval as well to be totally in the clear for using their script. But since when has the translation scene cared about silly things like obtaining permissions and honoring the Berne Convention, anyway?
No honor amongst thieves, right? :) (I won't get into a philosophical debate on the morality of asking permission and international copyright law, just pointing out how things currently are ... regardless, Enix wrote the original script and you most certainly do not have their permission to use it nor its' English translation. What logical ground is there to extend this courtesy to the fan translator(s), and not to the original script author(s)?)
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DaMarsMan
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« Reply #17 on: February 14, 2007, 02:54:04 pm » |
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Romhacker's code... I emailed Geechyguy asking if it was alright and if she could help out.
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Nightcrawler
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« Reply #18 on: February 14, 2007, 05:02:56 pm » |
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I agree with Neil and Byuu here. It sounds like you guys are throwing quality out the window and only care about quantity and getting it done with the old, 'we can still fix it later' mentality.
You know, I have used a particular text block for a tryout for translators who have auditioned to work on a project of mine. Sometimes 8 or 10 people would try the same block and yet a rather straight forward line of text has STILL been translated many different ways with ever so different styling depending on the person. Without doing the work all over again, it's not nearly as easy as you think just to 'fix it later' as far as styling and flow go.
I respect what you guys have done and still like you both on a personal level, but I don't really look forward seeing a DQ5 translation come out to what seems like a rushed hack job. Honestly, what is the big deal about needing to get it done as quickly as possible when it means sacrificing so much? What is wrong with waiting for a capable translator to take the script and do a real job on it?
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byuu
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« Reply #19 on: February 14, 2007, 06:41:42 pm » |
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I emailed Geechyguy asking if it was alright and if she could help out. -_-; Geechyguy = Male script editor Unknown person = Female translator -- I doubt anyone has this person's contact info at this point I respect what you guys have done and still like you both on a personal level, but I don't really look forward seeing a DQ5 translation come out to what seems like a rushed hack job. I hope this doesn't come off as offensive to Neil and co, but I really do feel that both of us could have done a much better job on DQ5. I regret forcing both of us to rush our releases, and I'd really like it if English speakers received a high-quality localization of DQ5, catering both to DQ and DW fans. Regarding the existing translations, the script could've been more faithful and clear for both, but I'm referring to the hacking especially. An 8x8 variable-width battle font would be trivial to add; the dialogue window would greatly benefit from translucency, or even a gradient fade, auto formatting support, and some font shadowing; the game really needs a "true" title screen (not the tiny thing you see when you start a new game), maybe throw in one of those vocal songs that are all the rage these days; and most ambitiously, the graphics could really afford to be touched up a little, possibly from the DQ3r/6 versions (easier than it sounds, sure). Something like what d4s did for BoF2. DQ5 really deserves it. This is something I really want to go back and do one day, but it's quite unlikely it will ever happen, sadly. As it stands, our best shot for the forseeable future is this PS2 translation, hence my concern over the translation. But you've already made up your mind, so I wish you luck with that goal.
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Neil
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« Reply #20 on: February 14, 2007, 07:01:38 pm » |
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Ok...Guessin he aint around anymore.
Geechyguy i haven't heard from in over a year. The translator, Nan, I haven't heard from since 2000. And at this point, i don't think anyone is criticizing you for not seeking their permission. I think everyone is more trying to talk you out of a quick sloppy job. You spent a lot of time working out the compression and such, and now you're going to make your work come off like shit by using a hacked together script. I mean, if that's what you want to do, more power to you. It just seems like you're putting a spoiler, pin stripes, an air intake kit, nitrous and diamond plated hub caps on a rusted out chevy celebrity.
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Kojiro
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« Reply #21 on: February 14, 2007, 07:38:22 pm » |
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A quick job? Maybe for testers, but certainly not for everyone and all eyes to see. I will admit that it was Greg's idea, but I know why he thought of it and it still isn't that half bad of an idea. I will say that it's not a rushed job, we both have deep feeling for this title and still do wish to make it feel like a remake of what WE played, right here in the states, what we know and love as a classic. We do not want the script to keep us from the work we have planned, so i see it as a stationary.
For example, if you needed to get across a stream to explore the other side immediately, or save someone's life we'll say. You wouldn't take the time out to build a bridge out of concrete steel and put time and effort into it right away. You'd post up a few logs or something real quick, and get on the other side and then build something more sturdy on your way back and for anyone else who needed to cross. That's how I see it anyway. I don't really know if thats what greg had in mind, but I'm sure it's something of that nature. We are prepared for things at the moment and we wanna take use of this moment before it passes up. Things happen, so we're prepared.
I'm not sure, but i think greg was going to leave garbage strings before Dark Force gave us his wonderful offer. So it's better we fill it with something understandable than some random sets of font prints on a dialogue window. When things all all said and done, we're still going to test out how the scripts work out in gameplay and re-write whatever according, so granted these strings have a high possibility of being altered. and we still have ALOT of ground to cover with an actual translator, far over half. Probably well over three quarters even. Not to mention Greg himself is quite fluent in Japanese.
I understand where you're all coming from, but I'm sure it's going to end up different than you would expect it to be at this point in time.
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Neil
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« Reply #22 on: February 14, 2007, 08:33:43 pm » |
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i would encourage you to play some of the fine dragon ball z translations. they were done with much the same mindset. some human translations here, some stuff taken from someone elses earlier attempts, some other random stuff. a rush job, under the guise that something in english of questionable quality is better than nothing.
Just to make sure, you do realize we're talking about an RPG, something that is story driven, text driven, right? What exactly is the point of patching something together script wise for an RPG? Isn't the entire point of the game the story? I mean, if we were talking about a fighter or a shooter i might see your point.
But you do realize that not everything can be fixed on a "rewrite", right? This is a translation, not a text hack, is it not?
There's a reason that the old dyslexic japancheese ff2 translation patch isn't in our archive.
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RedComet
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« Reply #23 on: February 14, 2007, 08:40:57 pm » |
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i would encourage you to play some of the fine dragon ball z translations. they were done with much the same mindset. some human translations here, some stuff taken from someone elses earlier attempts, some other random stuff. a rush job, under the guise that something in english of questionable quality is better than nothing.
Ouch.
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Kitsune Sniper
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« Reply #24 on: February 14, 2007, 10:08:46 pm » |
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i would encourage you to play some of the fine dragon ball z translations. they were done with much the same mindset. some human translations here, some stuff taken from someone elses earlier attempts, some other random stuff. a rush job, under the guise that something in english of questionable quality is better than nothing.
Ouch. Double ouch.
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Neil
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« Reply #25 on: February 15, 2007, 12:03:35 am » |
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present company excluded. :angel:
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DaMarsMan
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« Reply #26 on: February 15, 2007, 01:44:55 am » |
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I just don't get it. I started this project from the beginning with what you guys said in mine. I posted in the script help translations and on some other boards...I even posted for help on hongfire anime network. Very few people responded and the ones that did are gone by now. You think I didn't want a complete retranslation? Trust me I did more than any one of you. No one has stepped up to the plate, and until they do, I'm sticking with plan B so I can see my hard work and effort with the hacking in action. So instead of this whining about what I'm doing with my project, why don't you help out by finding someone capable and willing to do it? No, you'd rather just say I'm wasting my work by slopping together a translation. Damn, I consider wasting my work to be sitting around waiting for some eager, proficient translator to come aroung. My goal is to get this game in English. I will take whatever route is possible at the time. Maybe someone who is fluent will play the patch and want to do a retranslation.
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Kitsune Sniper
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« Reply #27 on: February 15, 2007, 02:35:22 am » |
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I just don't get it. I started this project from the beginning with what you guys said in mine. I posted in the script help translations and on some other boards...I even posted for help on hongfire anime network. Very few people responded and the ones that did are gone by now. You think I didn't want a complete retranslation? Trust me I did more than any one of you. No one has stepped up to the plate, and until they do, I'm sticking with plan B so I can see my hard work and effort with the hacking in action. So instead of this whining about what I'm doing with my project, why don't you help out by finding someone capable and willing to do it? No, you'd rather just say I'm wasting my work by slopping together a translation. Damn, I consider wasting my work to be sitting around waiting for some eager, proficient translator to come aroung. My goal is to get this game in English. I will take whatever route is possible at the time. Maybe someone who is fluent will play the patch and want to do a retranslation.
Gideon's spent years waiting for translated scripts. Sometimes desperation isn't the best route to take.
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Ryusui
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« Reply #28 on: February 15, 2007, 02:45:31 am » |
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*nods*
Trust me on this: don't half-ass a translation. It pays to take the time and effort to go the whole way. If you don't, you'll hate yourself and do the whole thing over again in self-punishment.
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Shinkinrui
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« Reply #29 on: February 15, 2007, 06:51:05 am » |
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I would like to interject here as a person who knows jack shit about ROM/game hacking/translation, but enjoys the fruits of the labor. I'm sure that with that first sentence, I have discredited anything else I'm going to say in this discussion, but I'm going to say it anyway. DQ5 is one of my all-time favorite games. Since I have the opportunity now, thanks so much to Neil and byuu and everyone else who worked on the SNES translation. Even if you consider your own work sub-par, I am unendingly grateful and feel that the work you did was awesome. Having said that, I'm very excited to see the PS2 version getting a translation(now I'm gonna need to find myself a Japanese copy of it and mod my PS2- but it will be SO worth it )! My own opinion on this is that before you knock what DaMarsMan is doing, you should remember that you're not him. See, I have my own little projects going(see my homepage for one of them), and I'm the type of person that if my projects don't see any largely visible progress for some time, I begin to lose motivation to work on them. Not a very good attribute for large projects, I know- but my point is, everyone has different ways of getting the job done and different things that motivate them. It seems that this thread is mostly filled with people actually discouraging DaMarsMan from doing this his way, and I don't feel that's fair. Don't get me wrong, I very much agree with this game getting a good quality translation. It's not like I'm speaking from experience or know all the history and details about what's going on here, but In my opinion this thread is less encouraging and supportive to DaMarsMan than it should be. So allow be to be the first in this thread to say this: Thank you so much for your work so far, and I'm very much looking forward to seeing this translation. I can only imagine how much painstaking work this much take- I'm pretty sure I could never complete a project like this. Here's to you, and the hope that you can
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« Last Edit: February 15, 2007, 07:13:06 am by Shinkinrui »
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