Well I looked over Disch's newer mapper document first. And it confirmed that mapper 118 is a mapper 4 variant which is what I thought. Anyway I was thinking of hacking Alien Syndrome when I noticed that there are two versions of it. Both have incompatible mappers. Alien Syndrome Japan uses mapper 1 with 128kb prg ram and 128kb chr ram. Alien Syndrome unlicensed uses mapper 118 with 128kb prg ram and 128kb chr ram. For some reason both use the same chr ram but have different prg ram. Or is it rom I am not so sure.

I want to change the mapper for the unlicensed one because it doesn't work correctly for many emulators. I tried mapper 1 and 4. 4 works but freezes after you start the game. The program suggested that I use mappers 6, 22, or 38. 38 works but shows garbage. I could continue through the list using the program to tell me what mappers are compatible. But then I have done this before and none that it suggested worked correctly.

Sorry I don't want to tell what program I use it's a secret not really. But I want tell unless you need to know. And this has nothing to do with playing it with nesticle. Mapper 118 also shows garbage even in fceu. So I reckon mapper 38 is correct but I am not sure.

I guess what I need to know is if there is a way to make it work correctly with mapper 4 because everything looks fine until it freezes.     

If it's in the ROM file then it's ROM  ;P.

They must have different PRG.  As you said, the mappers they use are incompatible.  So the code to interface with those mappers must be different.


This program sounds like it doesn't know what it's talking about.  I wouldn't use it anymore if I were you.

Mapper 6 is some lame FFE copier mapper.  For reasons I won't get into, I'll highly recommend you stay as far away from all FFE mappers...  especially if you're looking to improve support in emus.

Mapper 22 is VRC4, which has the same capabilities as MMC3 (mapper 4), but has a entirely different register layout.

I don't even know what mapper 38 is.  Whatever it is it's very obscure... and none of the emus I've checked support it (nor do I have any ROMs that use it).  So if you're looking to improve support in emus, you definately don't want to use it.

What on Earth emu are you using that runs mapper 38 but not 118 anyway?


No.  The game uses 1-Screen mirroring which mapper 4 simply does not provide (hence why it went with an MMC3 variant rather than a typical MMC3 setup).  Getting the game to work without 1Screen would be a ridiculous task.

MMC1 (mapper 1), however, does support 1-screen mirroring (why they left that off of MMC3 I'll never know), which explains why the J version could use it.  I would be willing to wager that a switch to MMC1 wouldn't be all that difficult... but you may want to examine the game a bit closer.

But note:  changing a mapper means more than just changing a number in the header.  It's a considerable size ASM hack.  If you're asking these kinds of questions with the intention of actually making this hack, you should pick up some 6502 docs and start reading.

There is no magic number that you can just switch to to make the game magically work in other emulators.  Different mapper numbers exist for good reason:  they work differently.  To change a game from one mapper to the other means rewriting routines in the game.

 :banghead: :banghead:
**Disch grips his head in frustration**


I beginning to think you don't know anything about them (actually, I've suspected that for a while, but I'm becoming more and more convinced of it as time goes on).  Your "playing around" with mappers seems to be paramount to randomly changing them and seeing how they break in various emulators.  I mean seriously.  Could you even describe to me what a mapper does?  Or do you just think it's just an ID number assigned to various ROMs?

At least this time you did check a doc -- but you only absorbed that 118 is similar to 004 -- you completely disregarded the differences between them.  You then proceeded to your usual method of random number plugging and experimenting.

That is not ROM hacking.  Maybe it would be if you uncovered some information from the results of your experiments... but you never do.


No need to document it... I already figured it out (read above).

And you still aren't "rewriting the mappers" like you seem to think you are.  I doubt in your various experiments you so much as changed a single byte of code in the ROM.  Changing the mapper number is not a complete mapper hack.  That is like the smallest (and actually probably the least significant) part of a mapper hack.  Changing the mapper involves rewriting all the routines that interface with the mapper so that they work with the new mapper registers instead of the old mapper registers.

But I've said this to you multiple times already.  If you didn't understand it then I doubt you'll understand it now.


Oh?

Your problem with Alien Syndrome is a mirroring issue... as I said in my previous post (Alien Syndrome uses 1-screen mirroring).  How come you can't fix it now without thinking?

I think what you meant to say is "I can change the header without thinking".

Speaking of mirroring.... do you even know the difference between mirroring modes?  What is the difference between H and V mirroring?  (Besides one works in some games and the other works in other games).


That doesn't work?  REALLY?!?!

Do you think it could be because Mapper 6 uses $42xx for registers and MMC3 uses $8000-FFFF?


Haw.  I'd love to see that.  The day you make a real ROM hack will be the day hell freezes over.


Well you sure fooled me.  I seem to recall a very similar topic involving mapper changes almost year ago.  Something tells me you never quite accomplished what you were looking to do in that thread.  I also doubt you even learned anything from the experience other than "adding VROM to a game is too hard".

You say you've been hacking for years, yet I've seen people who have acquired more ROM hacking knowledge in 10 minutes than you seem to have acquired during your entire lifetime.  The hacks on your nightmare of a webpage are so terrible... I can't even begin to imagine what could possibly have inspired you to make so many of them.


Wanting to learn about mappers without understanding basic NES functionality is like wanting to learn nuclear physics without first knowing algebra.  You can skim docs and recognize a handful of terms here and there, but none of it will do you any good.  The doc you said you already read already covers every detail of these mappers I could think of.


Incidentally... I thought you said you were leaving.  What ever happened to that?  It seems like all you do here is ruin our reputation and lower the gross IQ of the board.


I know the rule on these boards is if you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all.  But I've just about had it.  You scribble out halfassed rambling posts without content, contribute nothing in terms of content, ask questions you are in no position to understand the answer to, and just do a general job of wasting everyone's time.  Well I'm not going to waste mine anymore.

Ever thought he might be right?

I realize Me_Dave may be frustrating you to no end, but please leave the personal attacks/flaming out of it.  As you noted in your own post, it goes against the site rules, so it should be no suprise that a warning has been issued.


Cut it out.  You're not a moderator or staff, so don't assume you know what we will or will not do. Reporting things is enough.  Don't come back and try to rub it in peoples' faces that you reported them.