I think the main issue is people trying to put your hack/translation for sale at places like eBay. Protection for anti-eBay, etc., in my opinion is a good idea.

Disch and Odin:

You guys missed the boat. The target of this anti-hack code is people who want to SELL *MY/YOUR/OUR* work for money on ebay. Sharing work in the community is one thing. Sharing it with people who will sell it on ebay for a profit is another. If you can't see that difference, we shouldn't discuss this any further. Surely you don't think it's OK and should be accepted that this happens?

By the way, stealing work and passing it off as your own used to happen OFTEN back in the old days when we were all immature teens then. I never personally stole anyone's work, but there was plenty of food for the drama llama from accusations of stolen work for quite a few projects. FF5 for one. I don't remember any others by name. I wasn't really into following such news at the time.

Thankfully, the community seems to have evolved beyond that now a days and I don't feel that is much of an issue today. As you stated, in the event it still did happen, we'd find out and label and oust that person from our community.

Yes. Your view is clear. I would like to add one more point when it comes to other people building off your hack.

I have some mixed feelings on this. Perhaps even a bit hypocritical. On one hand, I believe in freely sharing information and work. I mean, that's how we progress and move forward. But on the other, I also generally expect someone to approach me and ask if they want to build off my hack. That's the potentially hypocritical part. We're not asking the game companies for permission, but I feel that's a bit different because in most cases, either they aren't around to ask or they'd never give permission anyway for any reason.

Why do I want people to ask my permission? One, I can usually give them some help. Thankfully, this is a motivating reason for them to approach me to begin with. Two, I have no problem sharing my work IF the cause is just. I don't want my work defaced. I suppose I view that as defacing to me in some respects. I prefer that only capable people work with it to do something positive. Three, it's simple respect for your fellow community members. I expect to have earned the respect for people to ask me by doing the work in the first place.

Also, if you implemented anti-hack code, and another group from another country came to you to ask for your blessings on a foriengn translation, I'm expect you'd be more than happy to fix up the anti-hack code to allow for that hack as well.

I just don't view anti-hack code as a problem and furthermore I think a little respect and a little asking can go a long way to overcome it even if it is. I know I personally have no problem allowing and even helping out a group who comes to me to ask to use my work as a base for their hack as long as their intentions are good. That's how the Polish version of Dual Orb 2 came to be.

I've found another pointer about this. Recently not if people selling our work but also hosting our hacks into full ROMS.

I've found plenty of hacks converted into full ROMs in ROM Sites.

I do see the difference... though I still have to ask if this is really a concern worth the effort.

I don't see what's stopping someone from taking your ROM hack as-is and selling it on eBay.  Putting an anti-eBay message or intro in the ROM is tacky in the first place... and even then the buyer won't see it until after they've paid and received the hack.  So I don't see how such hack protection helps this cause at all.  eBay lamers can still sell it just the same.


I see.  I guess I wasn't around for all that.  Regardless...  in the modern day world of ROM hacking -- it's pretty much a non issue.


So by that rationale... if a hacker has retired and disappeared or if they always refuse to let people build on their work... then it's okay to use their hack without permission?  I don't buy it.

I think the real reason people draw the line at ROM hacks is because the hacker has a face.  It's easier to "rip off" a faceless company than it is  a contributing individual.  Either that... or it's the commercial aspect -- it's okay to take a game from a company because they sell it -- but if someone is giving their work for free, then you should obey whatever guidelines the author submits and get permission where appropriate.

The latter is the general rule I buy into.  I will give such courtesy to freeware developers and ROM hackers, but won't think twice about ripping off game companies or emus like Magic Engine, No$, etc.  However this is a courtesy that's my decision to give.  I have no expectation that other people show the same courtesy with my work.  I'm not saying it wouldn't be appreciated... I mean of course it would.  But do I require it?  Absolutely not.  To require or even expect it is somewhat arrogant, IMO.  Showing respect is great, but demanding/requiring it defeats the point when it is received.  Ironically -- I find that humility generally leads to a greater show of respect.


What if software developers took the same stance?  What if, instead of being open source, programs were riddled with encryption mechanisms and checksums... and to modify them, you had to actually get in touch with the author and prove to him that you're worthy to modify his work?  What if emu authors had the same unreasonable fears of their work being sold on eBay?

Do you really think the authors of all these FCEU branches got direct permission from Xodnizel to modify his emu?  Did Geiger contact every SNES9x author before beginning work on his debugger?  Would any of you even expect him to?

Where do ROM hackers get the idea that their work is somehow more susceptible to exploitation than anyone else's?  Why do they see their work as some holy art form that has to be shown greater respect than any other art form?  Why do they feel the need to protect it on such absurd levels?  I just don't see the point.  It's completely contradictory to everything the freeware community stands for.

Yeah. Ow. That... um. That kinda hurt.

That's a pretty condescending statement for accusing people of being condescending. Add some names and it would be a flame. Knock of the instigation.